{"id":19843,"date":"2017-12-15T01:00:50","date_gmt":"2017-12-14T14:00:50","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.realestatetalk.com.au\/?p=19843"},"modified":"2017-12-15T01:00:50","modified_gmt":"2017-12-14T14:00:50","slug":"bitcoin-can-it-last-payg-for-investors-avoid-the-one-stop-shop","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/channels.realty.com.au\/realtytalk\/bitcoin-can-it-last-payg-for-investors-avoid-the-one-stop-shop\/","title":{"rendered":"Bitcoin \u2013 can it last? + PAYG for investors + Avoid the \u2018one stop shop\u2019"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><strong><em><u>Highlights from this week: <\/u><\/em><\/strong><\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>Brokers want to be on both sides of the investment fence<\/li>\n<li>Ways to reduce your tax during the year<\/li>\n<li>A sparky who got stung by a sprucer<\/li>\n<li>The bitcoin juggernaut<\/li>\n<li>How to bluff in a negotiation<\/li>\n<li>Increase your rental income without charging the tenant<\/li>\n<li>Where to stand when bidding at auction.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p><strong>Transcripts:<\/strong><\/p>\n<h2>Kill the &#8216;one stop shop&#8217; &#8211;\u00a0Andrew Mirams<\/h2>\n<p><strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 There\u2019s a lot of talk in the market now about the viability of brokers. A lot of real estate agencies have been into brokerage for some time, but we\u2019re seeing them now open up into other areas \u2013 turning on your power, helping you move, even getting into insurance. Is this a good thing, the one-stop shop?<br \/>\nI\u2019m going to ask Andrew Mirams from Intuitive Finance to address this with me now and talk specifically about whether brokers can be financial planners. I\u2019ll open it up with that to start with. Andrew, is that a good idea?<br \/>\n<strong>Andrew:<\/strong>\u00a0 Good day, Kevin. I\u2019m a little bit against that one-stop shop, I guess. Brokers are probably trying to now go into financial planning and even accounting and conveyancing, and things like that \u2013 more because a lot of those industries have probably tried to break into brokering.<br \/>\nI think there\u2019s a fair bit of evidence out there that neither of them has really worked that successfully. There are certainly some success stories out there. But the real issue I have with it is this. it depends how many brokers or how big your enterprise is, but if the brokers are trying to do the financial planning and the insurance as well as your loan and everything, is which part are they doing well?<br \/>\nAre they all doing just all of it okay, or are they doing a really good job? If they\u2019re doing a really good job, I would suggest they don\u2019t have too many clients, and how much exposure are they getting to all the different options and opportunities that there might be out there?<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 I guess you ask the question, too, whether they\u2019re doing it themselves or whether they setting up allegiances, which is in a way what some of the real estate companies have done. They\u2019ve set up allegiances with finance brokers. I know there are some that actually own the finance arm \u2013 as Ray White owned Loan Market, for instance \u2013but they trade as separate entities and tell you that never the twain shall meet. But it comes down, once again, to that one-stop shop rationale, doesn\u2019t it?<br \/>\n<strong>Andrew:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes. As a client, I would always ask myself, \u201cIf I\u2019m going there to get my mortgage and then they\u2019re doing my planning and they\u2019re doing my accounting, how impartial is the advice? Are they working together because they know that they\u2019re making X amount off me, or are they really doing the right thing for me?\u201d<br \/>\nThere\u2019s no right or wrong answer. I\u2019m a really big believer in allegiances and having a really great network around you, and that\u2019s both as a client and also as a business person, as a broker. We have a great cache of financial planners, accountants, insurance brokers, buyer\u2019s agents, all around us so when any client comes in here, I can say, \u201cThis will be great. I think you should go and see them.\u201d<br \/>\nThey\u2019re really happy. We sort of fit as the hub and we have all our spokes going out. We know we\u2019re referring them to really good people, that our clients are going to be really well looked after.<br \/>\nI quite like that philosophy a lot more than having everything in-house and the clients come in they think for a half-hour interview and three hours later, they\u2019re signing some insurance forms and they\u2019re not really sure what they\u2019re signing them for.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 I guess it comes down to what you said there. It\u2019s making sure that you know the people you are dealing with, that your clients are going to be well looked after. It goes much more than any trail you might pick up or any income that you might get. It\u2019s to know you\u2019re going to end up with a very happy client at the end of it.<br \/>\n<strong>Andrew:<\/strong>\u00a0 Absolutely. I would forgo all of that to make sure I\u2019ve got a happy client, because a happy client is going to recommend us again and again, and we\u2019re going to do more business that way.<br \/>\nI\u2019d much rather forgo all of that but have a happy client, because happy clients tell good stories. An unhappy client we tried to do everything for and mucked up, you end up losing all the business is the reality. You make one mistake on one of those entities if you\u2019re trying to do the planning, the accounting, and the brokering and you make one blue, you\u2019ll probably lose the total business.<br \/>\nI think, also, from risk management, there\u2019s a real issue you can lose clients if one of those entities makes a blue.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 It comes down to all the smart investors I know \u2013 and we talk about it all the time on the show \u2013 have their own team around them. They have their own finance broker, their own insurance broker, their own real estate agents who they work with, so they\u2019ve effectively got their own team. They don\u2019t need that one-stop shop anyway, Andrew.<br \/>\n<strong>Andrew:<\/strong>\u00a0 Absolutely. I\u2019m the same, Kevin. I have my own team around me, and our really strong clients and good investors have a really good team around them. They all work together but they\u2019re not intrinsically linked, so that if one of the team recommends one thing, there\u2019s quite an open dialogue in terms of saying, \u201cWhy are you recommending?\u201d and \u201cGive us the protocol.\u201d<br \/>\nFrom the client\u2019s perspective a good little test is \u201cWhy are you doing that?\u201d or \u201cWhy are you recommending that?\u201d Is it a good idea? Does that work? Go and talk to your accountant and come back to me and what I\u2019m recommending. I think that\u2019s a really good tasting mechanism for clients to be able to get a second opinion.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 We\u2019d love to hear your opinion, too. Let us know through the website. What do you think? Have you got your own team? You might have a view on that. Maybe you\u2019ve had a wonderful experience with a one-stop shop. Let us know.<br \/>\nWe\u2019d love to have your feedback through the show any time at Real Estate Talk. And make sure you catch up with Andrew and his team from Intuitive Finance at their featured channel on Real Estate Talk, as well.<br \/>\nAndrew, thanks for your time.<br \/>\n<strong>Andrew:<\/strong>\u00a0 My pleasure, Kevin.<\/p>\n<h2>PAYG for investors &#8211;\u00a0Brad Beer<\/h2>\n<p><strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Investors wait until the end of a financial year to take advantage of depreciation and the other deductions that they\u2019re entitled to, but there is a method which allows investors to receive their deductions more regularly. This involves submitting a Pay As You Go (or PAYG) withholding variation with the help of an accountant. Brad Beer from BMT Tax Deprecation joins me.<br \/>\nBrad, can you explain how a PAYG withholding variation works and why including depreciation claim in this process is going to help investors?<br \/>\n<strong>Brad: <\/strong>Yes, sure.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u00a0And hello, how are you?<br \/>\n<strong>Brad:<\/strong> \u00a0It\u2019s great to be here Kevin, as always.<br \/>\nIn about July 2000, they introduced the PAYG variation, and one of these is the legislation that simply allows you to change the way that the tax is paid or when it\u2019s paid.<br \/>\nAt the moment, you go to work, your employer pays you each fortnight or month, whatever it is, and they actually hold on to the tax and pay it to the government. You can actually have one of this adjustments done and say, \u201cLook, I\u2019m going to have some deductions this financial year and rather than the employer taking that tax out for me, how about we take out how much tax only is needed to be taken out through the year? And therefore, I\u2019ll pay less tax throughout the year and increase the cash flow through the year.\u201d<br \/>\nIt means you don\u2019t get a good tax return at the end of the financial year because you\u2019ve already worked it out, but it\u2019s a good way to keep hold of your cash rather than allowing it to be with the tax office for that year.<br \/>\nWhere a depreciation schedule fits into this is that depreciation is one of those deductions that because it\u2019s a non-cash deduction, at the end of the year, you get this quite substantial deduction that you haven\u2019t paid out.<br \/>\nWhat happens is you end up by reducing substantially your tax through the year instead of getting a big tax return at the end of the year. It\u2019s just one of the deductions that comes into that and it makes a pretty big difference because it\u2019s a non-cash deduction and the employer keeps the tax and gives it to the tax man and you could have that money and put it into your offset account or help reduce debt through the year instead.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Further to that, just to take that a little step further, what difference can a depreciation claim when it\u2019s combined with submitting a PAYG withholding variation make to an investor\u2019s cash flow, just from your experience, Brad?<br \/>\n<strong>Brad:<\/strong> \u00a0A simple example of a property worth about $500,000. We\u2019d see the deduction in the first year for depreciation to be about $10,000 on something like that. So, claiming or not claiming depreciation, it will depend on your marginal tax rate, but with a 37% marginal tax rate, a little case study that says \u201cDon\u2019t claim it, do claim it,\u201d the difference between the cost of owning a property of that sort of value is in the vicinity of $160 a week. That\u2019s a fair bit of money, because a $10,000 deduction makes a big difference if you don\u2019t pay it out.<br \/>\nWe invest in property to make money at the end of the day, and you do that through capital growth and through cash flow. Capital growth: you need to choose them in the right areas and do those sorts of things. And cash flow is maximizing the rent, minimizing the interest and the expenses, and maximizing the depreciation \u2013 and so you might as well get it.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin: <\/strong>\u00a0I know how delighted I\u2019d would be if a tenant offered to pay me an extra $160 a week. I\u2019d be pretty happy about that. That\u2019s for sure.<br \/>\n<strong>Brad:<\/strong> \u00a0You can\u2019t rent it for $160 a week over market because it will be vacant.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> \u00a0That\u2019s right; exactly.<br \/>\nBrad, does a PAYG withholding variation negate the need to submit a tax return?<br \/>\n<strong>Brad: <\/strong>\u00a0No. What it is it\u2019s a variation to what your tax return will look like at the end of the year. Your accountant does it. I\u2019m not the accountant, but what it means is you\u2019re estimating what the year is going to look like based on what you know, rather than the traditional method, which is you get to the end of the financial year, you submit everything to the tax office, and they give you the tax return.<br \/>\nYou still need to do that tax return, but this is up-front telling the tax office before it happens, what\u2019s really going to happen, because you know.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin: <\/strong>\u00a0What advice do you recommend investors should seek out before the consider taking up this option, Brad?<br \/>\n<strong>Brad: <\/strong>\u00a0It\u2019s a discussion with your accountant, because it doesn\u2019t necessarily work for every type of taxpayer. Most people or a large percentage of people are salary- and wage-earners in this country, and then your employer takes some taxes out of your check every time they pay you.<br \/>\nIf you\u2019re in a situation based on deductions that you know are going to happen \u2013 like property deductions, depreciation \u2013 is going to be different by the end of the financial year and you know that, it\u2019s the time where it\u2019s probably worth it. But talk to the accountant about that first and make sure it\u2019s going to be available before you go and try to do one.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong> Great advice. Something interesting, Brad, because it\u2019s something I didn\u2019t know about, so thanks for enlightening us. Brad Beer from BMT Tax Depreciation.<br \/>\nBrad, thanks for your time.<br \/>\n<strong>Brad:<\/strong> Thanks Kevin. A pleasure, as always.<\/p>\n<h2>Sparky falls for a spruker &#8211;\u00a0Bryan Loughnan<\/h2>\n<p><strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>\u00a0Our success story in the show this week is all about a Melbournian by the name of Callan, who was very dedicated to the idea of property investment from a very tender age \u2013 in his teenage years, actually.<br \/>\nIn fact, he was so keen to get started on the property ladder, that he saved about 30% of his wage when he was an apprentice electrician, diligently putting away about $100 a week. He watched it grow over the years.<br \/>\nBy the time Callan was 23, he was ready to buy his first property, but he does admit that his desire to buy outweighed his knowledge. We\u2019re going to get a little bit more information about that now from the man who helped him through that journey, Bryan Loughnan from Propertyology.<br \/>\nGood day, Bryan. How are you?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>Good Kevin. How are you?<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>It must be inspirational to work with young people like Callan and see how they\u2019re willing to make those sacrifices in the early days to get on to the property ladder.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>Absolutely. It\u2019s always good working with anyone who\u2019s interested in getting in the property market, Kevin, but yes, someone as young as Callan it\u2019s great to see.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>Did he find it confusing doing the research and understanding what he needed to know? Because I said in the introduction there that his desire outweighed his knowledge.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes. I suppose fortunately or unfortunately, Callan actually put his toe in the water for the property market before he came and met us and secured an off-the-plan property, an apartment in Melbourne. He felt he went a little astray with that and was led a little astray with that.<br \/>\nHe then started getting a little bit more involved in the research or trying to understand it, and that\u2019s when he came across us and we got involved with his second property.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>We\u2019ll deal with his second property in a moment. What did he find? What were the pitfalls of buying new like that off the plan?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>I think he just felt that he was sold to. I don\u2019t know the exact details of who he was dealing with, but he certainly told us that he felt very much like he was being sold to by a spruiker of sorts and felt he paid a premium for a property that may or may not turn out to be a great investment down the track.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>Does he still own that property?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>He does, yes.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>What\u2019s his intention with that? Is he going to have to hold it for a little bit longer?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes, he\u2019s going to hold that for now. I think as we can all see, that apartment market in Melbourne is one that is certainly has quite a bit of supply in the market at the moment, but he understands that it\u2019s a long-term asset class property, so he\u2019s happy to hold on to that one for now.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>Yes, when you buy like that, longer term that sometimes is necessary. I think, too, we have to realize that quite often these intermediaries stand to profit quite a lot, anything up to $50,000, which is really added to the purchase price.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>Absolutely. The developers aren\u2019t giving those sort of rebates, $10,000, $20,000, $30,000, as you said, up to $50,000, they\u2019re not doing that out of their back pocket. That often gets added on to the purchase price. And you combine that with just because you\u2019re buying brand new, everything is going to be shiny and everything is new, so you\u2019re not going to pay a premium anyway. You add that on top and it takes a long time to recoup some of those costs.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>Let\u2019s take us into looking into what Callan did from there. He understood that he made that mistake; he\u2019s holding on to it. Where did you take him to from there, Bryan?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>We spent a lot of time with Callan. I suppose we had to regain his confidence to some degree. He had felt like he was misled initially. So, we did spend a lot of time with Callan getting him to understand why actually drives a property market and what was he trying to achieve and talking him through that. That\u2019s a big part of what we did with Callan.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>Of course, Propertyology \u2013 and we\u2019ve discussed this with Simon Pressley in the past \u2013 great believers\u2026 You were the first people to tip that Tasmanian market \u2013 more particularly, the Hobart market \u2013 as being one to watch.<br \/>\nIt\u2019s interesting; I did an interview just this week and they\u2019re still tipping that Hobart is the market is to go to, but you guys were there a couple of years ago.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>Absolutely. I was talking about this with Simon previously, but we started buying in Hobart about four years ago. Callan was probably one of our first clients who we assisted in the Hobart market. He\u2019s had the benefit of the full upswing that we\u2019ve seen over the last couple of years, which is really exciting for him, and I have no doubt that his property that we purchased for around the $370,000 mark or maybe a little bit under that has probably already seen about 20% to 25% growth over that period of time.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>So, from there, what\u2019s his strategy for the future, Bryan?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:<\/strong>\u00a0 Callan spent quite a bit of time overseas in the last 12 months, so has probably put his next investment on hold for a little while, Callan is still young. He\u2019s in his mid to late 20s, so he wants to continue buying. He ideally would love to build an asset portfolio over the next 10 to 15 years, which might see him exit the workforce by the time he\u2019s 40 or in his mid-40s.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>I know it\u2019s a very scary prospect for a lot of people who are looking to get into the property market, particularly young people, they look at the Sydney and Melbourne markets, which are really very, very expensive, but there are good regional opportunities, aren\u2019t there, Bryan?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>Absolutely. If you actually break down the average property price across Australia and then you look outside of those major capital cities, there are a lot of people who live in major regional centers. And we\u2019re not talking about 5000 population, mining dustbowls in Western Queensland here, Kevin; we\u2019re talking about major regional centers.<br \/>\nPeople who live in those areas actually think those of us who live in capital cities and sit in traffic for an hour or two each morning and each afternoon, they think we\u2019re the crazy ones. There are plenty of opportunities out there, and markets that over time, history has shown have performed very strongly, if not stronger than some of the capital cities.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:\u00a0 <\/strong>Bryan, great talking to you. Congratulations on the work that you\u2019re doing. I\u2019m sure that Callan will be joining me in thanking you as well.<br \/>\nBryan Loughnan has been my guest. Bryan is the head of Property Acquisitions at Propertyology. You can contact him by using the link on any one of the pages right here on Real Estate Talk and also having a look at their featured channel.<br \/>\nGood on you, Bryan, and we\u2019ll talk to you again soon. Thanks, mate.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryan:\u00a0 <\/strong>Thanks, Kevin.<\/p>\n<h2>How to bluff at an auction &#8211;\u00a0Bryce Holdaway<\/h2>\n<p><strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 If you\u2019re intending to go bid at a property auction this weekend, here are some great bidding tips for you as a buyer. Joining me to talk about those from EmpowerWealth.com.au \u2013 they are buyer\u2019s agents \u2013 Bryce Holdaway.<br \/>\nGood day, Bryce. How are you?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 Hey, Kevin. Good. How are you?<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Good. Are you bidding at any auctions this weekend?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, we\u2019re always bidding at auctions everywhere.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, that\u2019s your business. Tell me some of the strategies you use or some of the advice you\u2019d give for people going to an auction to bid for themselves.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 The number one, Kevin \u2013 this is easier said than done \u2013 is you have to have this supreme confidence that you\u2019re there to buy. It\u2019s largely a game of bluff, and you need to let the other bidders who are bidding against you know that you mean business and you\u2019re there to buy. It\u2019s actually not easy to do, given it\u2019s that public speaking environment and everyone can get a little bit intimidated.<br \/>\nThe analogy that I talk about is you\u2019ve set a limit, and let\u2019s call that the cliff face. Your job is to run as hard as you possibly can at that cliff face knowing that no sane human being would actually ever jump; you\u2019re going to stop right at the very end. But right up until the point where you do stop, someone who is observing you would look at you and \u201cOh my goodness, he\u2019s going to jump off.\u201d<br \/>\nThat\u2019s the same analogy when it comes to bidding at an auction. You have to run at that cliff \u2013 i.e. your upper limit \u2013 as hard and as fast and as confident and as boldly as you can, because what you\u2019re doing is sending a message to the other bidders that you mean business and you want to buy, even though at the end of the day, every single person \u2013 including your buyer\u2019s agent \u2013 has a limit.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019ve never heard it expressed that way, but really, you\u2019re just showing absolute confidence. You have no hesitation whatsoever, just very bold.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 I\u2019ve seen people turn up in Porsches. I\u2019ve seen people wear the preppy vests. I\u2019ve seen people put the Tom Cruise aviators on. I\u2019ve seen people try to intimidate people at the beginning of an auction. The only thing I\u2019ve ever seen consistently work is confidence, and as I said at the top, it\u2019s easier to say than to do. But it is the number one tactic, in my view, for anyone at auctions.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Okay. Another one?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 For me, position where I stand is really critical. I actually want to stand on the shoulder of the auctioneer. If you imagine the auctioneer standing in front of the property looking at the crowd of bidders, I want to either be on his left shoulder or on his right shoulder and enough distance away from the auctioneer that he or she doesn\u2019t feel like I\u2019m encroaching on their space, because these auctioneers have big egos and you don\u2019t want to go into that space where you\u2019re actually putting them off.<br \/>\nBut the reason I want to stand there is I want to see what the auctioneer sees. And I actually want to make sure that if anyone is bidding against me, I want to know who they are to be able to look them in the eye.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 That\u2019s very intimidating.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 It is. That\u2019s my job, to be professionally intimidating so that people keep their hands in their pockets. Because my third tip is once I know who my bidders are, I watch them. I don\u2019t spend much time focusing on the auctioneer; I spend all my energy focusing on the other bidders because I want to know (a) who they are, and (b) I want to look for their non-verbal body language.<br \/>\nI want to know when they\u2019re starting to get sweaty. I want to know when they\u2019re starting to get fidgety. I want to know when they have that look, the one, Kevin, where all of a sudden, the bid comes in and their eyes dart to their partner, because I know they\u2019ve just reached their limit and I\u2019m pretty close to going in for the kill.<br \/>\nSo, I want to look at them and I want to maintain eye contact with them. I spend more time focusing on them than I do on the auctioneer.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Wow. What next?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 The next one is I call the auctioneer by name. Kevin, you\u2019re the auctioneer. I\u2019m standing on the shoulder. I\u2019m looking at my competition, and it comes in for a bid. I\u2019ll go, \u201cI\u2019ll give you another $1000. Thanks, Kevin,\u201d and I say your name purposefully.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Why is that?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 Because I want the perception that there\u2019s a really tight relationship between me and the auctioneer. I want the other people who are bidding against me to go \u201cHang on a second, what\u2019s going on here?\u201d They put their hands in their pockets and they go \u201cDo these guys actually know each other?\u201d<br \/>\nThe reality is I don\u2019t know them\u2026 Well, I probably do know them a lot better than the people in the crowd, but there is certainly no commercial relationship other than I\u2019m just calling him by name; no one else is doing that because I want the perception.<br \/>\nRemember this is two parts strategy, one part bluff. I want the perception that we\u2019re in bed together, and I want them to start going in their mind \u201cWhat\u2019s going on here?\u201d and then hopefully, put their hands in their pockets.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Wow. I never want to bid against you. What else, mate?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 My fifth one is slow the bids down to $1000 as quickly as possible. A clever auctioneer won\u2019t let you do that. But my job is to slow the bidding down; their job is to slow the bidding up. I will do whatever it takes. If they ask for ten, I\u2019ll give them a five. If they ask for five, I\u2019ll give them a one. Clever auctioneers won\u2019t let you do that, but I\u2019ll be persistent.<br \/>\nDon\u2019t be afraid, when they\u2019re calling for a $10,000 bid and they won\u2019t reduce it, actually give them $13,000 because what happens is the next one, they want to round up, so the next one they\u2019ll obviously accept it is a seven, and then you can match the seven.<br \/>\nYou can actually strategically get your way down to a lower amount as quickly as you can. But ultimately, you want to slow the bids down to $1000 as quickly as you can.<br \/>\nA slight footnote to that is I never really bid less than $1000, because I only see people bid less than $1000 can make close to their top limit, so I don\u2019t want to send any messages to my competitors that I\u2019m close to my upper limit.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, quite intimidating, too, if the bidding does actually get down to $500, then you throw in another $1000, it\u2019s almost going to knock them out as well.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes. No one does $500 unless they\u2019re very, very close to their upper limit.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes. What else, mate?<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 My last one is don\u2019t bid against yourself. If you\u2019re in a situation where the auctioneer throws in a vendor bid and you\u2019re the person who had the bid prior to them, keep your hands in your pocket. Don\u2019t bid against yourself, because what they want to do is throw in another vendor bid and then all of a sudden, you realize there\u2019s actually no one else here. I\u2019m the only competition; I\u2019m working against myself.<br \/>\nSo if the auctioneer puts in a vendor bid and it\u2019s over to you, sit tight. Wait until the very end, and if you want to throw in a final one just to make sure that you have the right of first refusal to negotiate the reserve price, you do that. But during the auction, never, ever bid against yourself.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 There you go. Some great strategy insight there. Go back and have another listen to that, I can tell you. Bryce Holdaway is a buyer\u2019s agent from EmpowerWealth.com.au.<br \/>\nBryce, thank you for that insight, mate. I can tell you, I certainly don\u2019t want to bid against you this weekend. That\u2019s for sure.<br \/>\n<strong>Bryce:<\/strong>\u00a0 Good on you. Thanks, Kevin.<\/p>\n<h2>The Bitcoin juggernaut &#8211;\u00a0Graham Cook<\/h2>\n<p><strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 There\u2019s been a lot of talk about Bitcoin, watching its value. I guess you\u2019re probably a bit like me and wish you had jumped on that bandwagon a little while ago with the value that it is now, but is it such a good investment overall?<br \/>\nGraham Cook, who is the Insights Manager for Finder, joins me, and he says that it\u2019s not really a foolish investment.<br \/>\nGood day, Graham.<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Good day, Kevin. How are you doing?<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Good, thank you. Wouldn\u2019t you have loved\u2026 Maybe you did get on Bitcoin. Did you?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 I tell you; I actually ghost-wrote a blog about Bitcoin about a year ago when it was about $2000 and was talking about how great it would have been to be on the gravy train at that point. And now it\u2019s $11,000 U.S. and God, I wish I had invested then.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Isn\u2019t it funny? We talk about this all the time and we say, \u201cWell, it\u2019s never too late.\u201d Is it too late, do you think?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 The thing is nobody really knows. You can go onto the Fairfax and news media today and you can read completely conflicting articles about whether or not it\u2019s a good idea to get involved in Bitcoin.<br \/>\nThe price has been on an absolute wild ride this year. We\u2019ve seen it peak at $10,000 and then possibly predictably drop a little bit as it hit that ceiling \u2013 that arbitrary ceiling, really \u2013 and then start to bounce back since then.<br \/>\nThe thing is whether this is a bubble or whether this isn\u2019t a bubble\u2026 It definitely looks like a bubble, but nobody knows when that bubble is going to burst. Is it going to be at $15,000 U.S.? Is it going to be at $250,000? It\u2019s all wait and see at this point.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s a bit of a barometer, isn\u2019t it? When you see it come off, maybe people are now saying it\u2019s peaked; it\u2019s not going to go any further, they wait and they see that it doesn\u2019t fall, so they jump back in and it increases again in price. You could almost watch it like a barometer.<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes. There\u2019s an element of psychology involved with these things, as well. The value it\u2019s increased at is faster than, I think, any commodity we\u2019ve seen. It has a Gold Rush fever almost. You\u2019re seeing the grandparent investors getting involved now and everything. Whether this will end up being a party for everybody involved or whether there are going to be tears at the end of this road, we don\u2019t really know.<br \/>\nBut we did ask economists in our monthly REA survey\u2026 So this is leading economists in Australia; it\u2019s the biggest survey of its kind. We asked them if they think getting involved in Bitcoin is a foolish investment, and 80% came back and said they don\u2019t think so.<br \/>\nI was expecting it to be a bit more disapproval. If the economists are on board, then maybe it is a wise investment.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Okay, we\u2019ll keep any eye on that one. A couple of other things I wanted to talk to you about, too, Graham, if I may. One is the royal commission into the banks. What\u2019s your feeling about all of that?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 The thing is this has been bubbling for quite a while. It\u2019s three or four years now that people have been asking for royal commission. The banks have been saying we don\u2019t need a royal commission. The government has been saying we don\u2019t need a royal commission. The opposition has been saying we do. But it\u2019s been going on for so long, it was almost inevitable at this stage.<br \/>\nWhat triggered it in the end was all four banks coming and saying, \u201cOkay, let\u2019s have this commission. Let\u2019s kill this uncertainty in the market and this doubt against the banks.\u201d They want to clear the air.<br \/>\nPotentially, by the fact that they, themselves, have asked for it, it seems that the banks, anyway, don\u2019t think there are too many skeletons in the closet that could be uncovered by the inquiry over the next year, but of course, time will tell.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Of course, it\u2019s also the fact that they get a little bit more control about what the commission will cover, as well.<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes, exactly, and they\u2019ll have the government running it more closely than if it had been driven by opposition parties. It\u2019s also going to be a relatively short investigation; it\u2019s reporting back in a year\u2019s time. But once you start to open those Pandora\u2019s boxes, who knows what\u2019s inside?<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Do you think it\u2019s going to have any impact at all on what the RBA may do over the next, say, three or four months?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 I don\u2019t know if the RBA is going to be doing an awful lot. That actually leads into a question about interest rates. This is another one that we\u2019re asking our economists every month. We\u2019ve seen no movement at all now in the RBA cash rate or well over a year. I think it\u2019s actually 16 months in a row. I tell you; it\u2019s been getting quite difficult to write about the cash rate every month when it hasn\u2019t been doing anything; it\u2019s just been sitting there.<br \/>\nBut the economists are now saying they\u2019re not expecting another rate movement until at least the third quarter of next year. Still no movement in January, so we\u2019re talking six months from then of stagnant cash rate, and then potentially a movement after that.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Graham, on the tail end of that, do you think that borrowers should now be locking in their interest rates with the bank?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Now is definitely a good time to look at locking them in. The thing is in this low-interest world, the only way, really, the cash rate could potentially go is up. The question is when that happens, but it\u2019s definitely heading in that direction.<br \/>\nYou could have three or four months you can wait before you lock in your fixed rate, but we\u2019re definitely look at rates moving up towards the second half of next year, so it would be a good time to look at locking in your rates around now.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 What are the trends like for 2018? What\u2019s going to be happening as we\u2019re entering a brand-new property investment year? What\u2019s the inside running? What are they saying about next year? What\u2019s likely to be happening?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 There are three main trends that are being signaled by economists for 2018 that we could see from the survey of 40 or so that we conducted this month.<br \/>\nThe first thing is we\u2019re still going to see growth in the capital cities but we\u2019re going to see slower growth. We\u2019re going to see single-digit growth, definitely in Sydney and potentially, across the other capital cities \u2013 with some surprising cities that they\u2019re picking as exhibiting the highest growth next year. Hobart is one that came out across the board that\u2019s going to be a good investment.<br \/>\nSo, continuing increasing property prices in houses \u2013 slower than previously, though. But where it\u2019s really going to change is in terms of apartments. We\u2019ve seen a lot of economists come out and say that the over-supply of apartments, the potential glut of apartments that\u2019s about to hit the market could lead to a softening of unit prices next year. I actually saw one economist refer to \u201cthe collapse of the apartment market,\u201d so price is definitely going to be more volatile there.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Just on that point, before we go any further, Graham, are they highlighting any particular cities, or was that just a general statement?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Melbourne was the one that came up most regularly in terms of cities, and Sydney as well. But definitely, there are a lot of cranes across the Melbourne skyline. There are a lot of apartments going to come onto the market there.<br \/>\nWe\u2019re also seeing potentially a sign of an issue with apartments in Sydney, for example. Some developers are now offering discounts of $50,000 for first-home buyers trying to buy units in areas that have a high concentration of units. So, there could be a potential sign that they\u2019re starting to sell those units. If you\u2019re going to invest in apartments, definitely it\u2019s good to be cautious in this coming year.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 What a lot of people have lost sight of, too, is the fact that that vacancy tax is about to click into play in Victoria as of January 1, and some people are saying that it could bring as many as 20,000 extra units onto the market in the Melbourne market alone.<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Which again will be pushing prices down and will definitely make it a volatile investment. If you\u2019re going to invest in property, keep it towards the inner parts of the city and keep it in houses.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Okay, and some of the other tips that are coming from these economists?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Aside from slow growth and apartment issues, the third one that came through was something we\u2019re calling renovesting. With the property ladder becoming increasingly difficult to climb, we\u2019re expecting to see an increased number of Australians next year trying to increase the value of their property through actually renovating and getting new kitchens and new bathrooms and new bedrooms and stuff.<br \/>\nThat\u2019s been cited by a handful of economists and something we\u2019ve seen people mention a little bit in our consumer survey as well, so we expect that renovesting to be a bigger trend in 2018.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 What\u2019s involved in renovesting?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Literally, you have some cash, you\u2019re trying to spend it somewhere, you can\u2019t move up the property ladder, so you decide to go for the new kitchen, you decide to get the deck laid outside.<br \/>\nThese small changes to the appearance of a house can actually make quite a big difference to what the house will make on the end, especially if it goes to auction. It\u2019s one way that we\u2019re increasingly going to see Australians trying to add value to their homes.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 It\u2019s a bit \u201cImprove rather than move,\u201d isn\u2019t it?<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 \u201cImprove rather than move.\u201d That\u2019s a good phrase. I\u2019m going to use that.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 You\u2019re welcome to use that. I won\u2019t charge you for that. There is a program on television that springs to mind, <em>Love It or List It<\/em>. I find it\u2019s intriguing to watch what happens with someone when they believe that they want to make a move and then someone comes in and renovates the house or improves it, and they fall back in love with it, and most times, they\u2019ll elect to stay as opposed to moving.<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Yes. Often, it\u2019s surprising what a lick of paint can do in terms of changing your environment \u2013 definitely a trend we expect to see more of in the future.<br \/>\n<strong>Kevin:<\/strong>\u00a0 Indeed. Graham Cook who is the Insights Manager for Finder.com.au, my guest. Thanks for your time, Graham.<br \/>\n<strong>Graham:<\/strong>\u00a0 Thank you, Kevin.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Highlights from this week: Brokers want to be on both sides of the investment fence Ways to reduce your tax during the year A sparky who got stung by a sprucer The bitcoin juggernaut How to bluff in a negotiation Increase your rental income without&#8230;<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":176692471,"featured_media":19844,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[10,11,13,24],"tags":[101],"class_list":["post-19843","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-kevin-turner-sponsored-channels","category-kevin-update","category-latest-story","category-shows","tag-podcast"],"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO plugin v27.5 - https:\/\/yoast.com\/product\/yoast-seo-wordpress\/ -->\n<title>Bitcoin \u2013 can it last? 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